Web 2.0 Hype Paper Wins Top Presentation at AGI

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Thursday, September 25. 2008

Web 2.0 Hype Paper Wins Top Presentation at AGI

We just wrapped up the final session of the AGI GeoCommunity '08 Conference. I'll be providing more about key papers and ideas over the next few days. But I want to share what just happened because, frankly, it confuses me.

Before lunch Mark Bishop a product manager at MapInfo presented a paper titled "The Hype of Web 2.0." He did a terrific job of defining the differences between Web 1.0 and Web 2.0 complete with a picture of Tim O'Reilly and lots of examples of (non-map/non-geo) webpages. Toward the end there was a video of a MapInfo implementation of "slippy maps." AJAX is Web 2.0. The presentation was lively, though Bishop had to encourage audience participation (sort of ironic since Web 2.0 is about that!).

I was a bit antsy since the presentation didn't address geo (much) nor provide any specific suggestions regarding how geo could/should/would take further advantage of Web 2.0. Further, I thought we were all pretty set with understanding, if not implementing, Web 2.0 ideas, so I wondered how this presentation fit into this geospatial conference.

Apparently I was the only one who thought so. The presentation was selected by the entire attendee group as their favorite presentation. Perhaps Web 2.0 has been bandied about so much attendees needed a refresher course and this was it? Perhaps attendees never felt comfortable with Web 2.0 concepts and this was a first definition for them? Perhaps attendees keep their heads down doing their GIS work and don't think much about the technology ideas going on around them? Perhaps this is a difference between the US/UK interaction with technology? Perhaps "favorite" was interpreted in a different way than I did? Any other ideas?

Posted by Adena Schutzberg in Conferences at 10:27 | Comments (11) | Trackbacks (0)

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Mark Bishop's presentation may not have been bleeding edge or especially on topic for this conference, but I thought it was a useful and lively reminder that Web 2.0 presents an opportunity to improve user interation and communication. He reminded us that Web 2.0 has changed the map, literally, creating a market for geo that was barely existed before Google Maps. Enterprise systems, geospatial or otherwise, have been slow to take advantage of the new technology and the "user at the centre" philosophy it embodies. Now, must get my company wiki project back on track...

#1 James Harris on 2008-09-25 12:15 (Reply)

I have to agree - ive put a post up with thoughts myself on the conference:

http://digitalurban.blogspot.com/2008/09/agi-and-web-20.html

Probably does me no good at all to raise my head on this one but the whole thing is perplexing - and this is from someone who gave a talk on Web 2.0...

#2 Andy Hudson-Smith (Link) on 2008-09-26 05:04 (Reply)

Perhaps it is no more than a freak of statistics. If you have 5 papers on web mapping, 5 on distaster planning, 5 on ROI and a single paper on the single paper is going to win every time, simply because the votes for the other subjects are spread out between more papers.

On the other hand however, it was a most enjoyable presentation and many congratulations are much deserved for Mark, regardless of what we think of the subject matter.

#3 Richard Geary (Link) on 2008-09-26 11:37 (Reply)

Apologies, the above comment should read "... a single paper on (insert subject name here) the single paper is going to win..." Serves me right for trying to use angle-brackets!

Feel free to edit the above and delete this, if you're able to.

#4 Richard Geary (Link) on 2008-09-26 11:40 (Reply)

I was provided with 25 minutes to present. I had 3 objectives.

1. Define web 2.0 – In my role I speak to many people in the LI industry but also outside of core LI (business, not consumers). Some techie and some non-techie. Believe it or not - many have never heard of the term Web 2.0. Others have heard of Web 2.0 via a marketing gimic, or through the term being misused. (maybe this is a UK thing). Of course there are also many well informed members of the LI community who understand web2.0 - I learn a great deal from them. However a lot of these informed people are either in the consumer space, small entrepreneurs or “web 2.0” vendors.

2. Identify the hype (and have some fun doing it)

3. Try to get people to leave the conference thinking differently about Web2.0 and their enterprise.

I agree that there was not much Geo in my short presentation. But I see many people flaming traditional Location Specialists (sometimes rightly so) without offering them the small steps required to move forward. I wanted to present the small steps rather than leap for the moon. The community that I had the privilege to speak to yesterday will be the ones shaping the changing world, by embracing new technologies. I don’t think it will be a vendor (me) with 34 powerpoint slides. Audience participation was difficult – it is always difficult. Perhaps this is a reflection that 2.0 in business (geo or otherwise) is also difficult.

I also find it ironic that a presentation that I deliberately made as basic, simple, clear and as fun as possible (presentation style 2.0?). Has left industry experts and thought leaders confused and perplexed. I even tested all of the content on my girlfriend - a non-GIS, non-techie, non-blogger, non-RSS’r, non-hacker, never heard of web2.0 (but born in generation Y and facebook user). If she didn’t get what I was saying I removed it from the deck.

I also presented 2 hours before the voting was cast which probably helped.

Thanks for the positive comments and I'm pleased the crowd enjoyed it.
Mark
Slides can be found via my blog.

P.S next year (if I'm fortunate enough to have a paper accepted) I may consider hosting a web-based powerpoint app prior to the event. All delegates can then contribute and craft the slides web2.0 style! (but that would be old hat by then - participation, not publishing.)

#5 Mark Bishop (Link) on 2008-09-26 12:17 (Reply)

Its a sad reflection on our industry that so few people have an understanding of Web2.0 and how it can transform the way we work. I think you've hit the nail on the head when you say that GIS people are too focused on their own world to notice what's going on around them.

I quote Mark (2004): "I told a lot of the top guys at the AGI they were a dinosaur organisation with outdated views and an academic focus."

You can pretty much apply that to the whole GI world. The most interesting thing about Neogeography is that it isn't being done by Geographers, they're too busy thinking about projections and coordinate systems.

#6 Christopher Osborne (Link) on 2008-09-26 19:03 (Reply)

Perplexing? Sure. Indicative of an industry with room to advance? Yep. Positive? Definitely!

Rather than being frustrated by the speed of adoption of Web 2.0 concepts and beating up on the traditional geo community how about we view this as a good sign? It's an indication that there's strong interest in Web 2.0 in the AGI forum! Hopefully the audience will take away knowledge and presentation ideas, and use them to move the industry forward. We're still in an evangelism phase with Web 2.0 and the Geoweb so presentations that enlighten audience responses like this should be applauded.

#7 Peter Barnes on 2008-09-28 13:20 (Reply)

I agree with Peter. An exciting aspect of the conference was the high level of interest from the traditional practitioners in web 2.0 and GeoWeb.

I find the responses of the cognoscenti somewhat elitist - "what haven't you got it yet?" Outside of a narrow circle I don't think many people have a clue what Web 2.0 is about, this is not restricted to people in the GI industry. Just because you use Google Maps, You Tube and Facebook does not imply any understanding of web 2.0 and why should it?

My view of the conference can be found at http://giscussions.blogspot.com

Steven

#7.1 steven feldman (Link) on 2008-09-29 03:27 (Reply)

Steven was chair of the event.

#7.1.1 Friend on 2008-09-29 11:57 (Reply)

It sounds like the Association of American Geographers (AAG) gathering last week prompted similar discussions, and interesting debate regarding the role of the traditional geo community in keeping corporations honest.

Check out Sean Gorman's blog:
http://blog.fortiusone.com/2008/09/23/the-neotards-enter-the-den-of-the-paleotards-geoweb-at-the-aag/

#7.2 Peter Barnes on 2008-09-29 04:30 (Reply)

yes, the rest of the word is at 3.0 - even the EU

http://www.networkworld.com/news/2008/092908-eu-wants-to-take-lead.html

#8 Jonas Tate on 2008-09-29 16:09 (Reply)

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